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Why isn't everyone doing the Hoerner wing tip

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  • Why isn't everyone doing the Hoerner wing tip

    Looking over the benefits of the Horner wing tip

    why do the standard wing tip?

    is there a downside...or is it a free lunch
    Last edited by way_up_north; 07-02-2020, 07:01 AM.

  • #2
    Because it is store bought and easy in a lot of cases, including mine. If a Hoerner tip were easy, I would have bought them instead.

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    • #3
      The same reason not everyone is fitting VGs, EFII, autopilot etc. Keep it simple, keep the cost down ......

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      • Nev
        Nev commented
        Editing a comment
        PS how’s retirement?

      • PaulSA
        PaulSA commented
        Editing a comment
        Excellent! - except I can't fly my RV-10 due CV19 restrictions .....

        Don't let anyone tell you "What are you going to do with yourself ......?"

    • #4
      Would a Hoerner tip have the same effect on the Bravo model ? It already has additional wing area and span.
      Nev Bailey
      Christchurch, NZ
      Bearhawk Bravo, 4 place Quick-build #25B.

      Comment


      • #5
        Hi
        Originally posted by PaulSA View Post
        The same reason not everyone is fitting VGs, EFII, autopilot etc. Keep it simple, keep the cost down ......
        I’m 1 to 2 years away from needing one... if available

        were not talking building the space shuttle here... it’s an easy build for a fiberglass company... if there is demand

        if its the prefered choice... then there is time for me to get the word out... so by the time I need it... it’s nice and cheap

        has anyone contacted the current fabricator to see if they would be interested in making it?

        how many Bearhawks are flying with them?... any reports ?



        Last edited by way_up_north; 07-02-2020, 07:07 AM.

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        • JimParker256
          JimParker256 commented
          Editing a comment
          "so it's nice and cheap..."

          LOL The words "cheap" or "inexpensive" cannot be used in the same sentence as "airplane"...

        • way_up_north
          way_up_north commented
          Editing a comment
          How about economical .... lol
          Last edited by way_up_north; 07-02-2020, 09:07 AM.

      • #6
        I thought lsilverone had posted you could order hoerner wing tips from him for the B model.

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        • #7
          Originally posted by rodsmith View Post
          I thought lsilverone had posted you could order hoerner wing tips from him for the B model.
          Thanks for posting that... I was not aware .., I’ll send him an email

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          • #8
            Originally posted by way_up_north View Post
            Looking over the benefits of the Horner wing tip

            why do the standard wing tip?

            is there a downside...or is it a free lunch
            I had a look at this too, found that: THEORETICAL_ASPECTS_AND_PRACTICAL_US_AGE.pdf

            Comment


            • rodsmith
              rodsmith commented
              Editing a comment
              Nice concise write up of why they are effective at lowering drag, increasing efficiency of the wing.

          • #9
            Other than the cost of making them, they are a free lunch so to say.

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            • #10
              What’s the real world performance gains over the standard tips for the Bearhawk models that have them? Not disputing the Hoerners are better, just trying to gage whether the juice would be worth the squeeze, so to speak?
              Todd Stovall
              PP ASEL - IA
              RV-10 N728TT - Flying

              Comment


              • Mark Goldberg
                Mark Goldberg commented
                Editing a comment
                Hi Todd. We hope to test and document the difference (hopefully improvement) sometime soon. Mark

            • #11
              The thing I like about hoerners is that they increase the effective wingspan. With rounded tips air spills from the bottom of the wing up and onto the top of the wing shortening the effective span. Hoerners eliminate this spillage. Plus they look cool.😁

              Cutting the foam block and forming the tips is actually quite easy. We ran into trouble when making the molds which is when I threw in the flag and slapped spill-plate tips on our plane. My pops has started making new foam plugs and a local guy said he’d make us molds and carbon tips for a reasonable amount. After kicking the idea around we decided to skip the molds and just make if one-off set of tips using the plugs.

              Also, I made some patterns for making aluminum hoerner tips that I think would be very close to as clean as fiberglass tips. The compound curve at the leading edge was challenging so it is a little dirty but I think it could be worth pursuing. I stopped when I make forms for tip ribs and hat sections to stiffen things up.
              Scratch Built 4-place Bearhawk. Continental IO-360, 88” C203 McCauley prop.

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              • #12
                Originally posted by whee View Post
                The thing I like about hoerners is that they increase the effective wingspan.
                So in essence they're winglets?
                Mark
                Scratch building Patrol #275
                Hood River, OR

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                • #13
                  Regarding post #10.....This thread starts out with Battson's modifications and compares a number of changes including his Hoerner tips.
                  https://bearhawkforums.com/forum/fly...wk-performance

                  An article that compares three wingtip shapes (Square, Round, and Hoerner) in a wind tunnel may be found on Page 38 of Sport Aviation Magazine, Feb 1971 for those who are EAA members. I'd be interested in your feedback.

                  My opinion is Wind Tunnel data is data, but not real life data. However, Battson's report seems to me to confirm its findings. The square tip is a flat square, unrounded shape. I've shared before my curiosity of the wingtip Steve Wittman used on his W-10 Tailwind design. I think it ugly but I also think Wittman tested things on real airplanes. Whee might be surprised by his square tip performance. Mooney likes the square tip.

                  https://www.eaa.org/eaa/news-and-pub...viation-browse
                  Last edited by Bcone1381; 07-03-2020, 11:11 AM.
                  Brooks Cone
                  Southeast Michigan
                  Patrol #303, Kit build

                  Comment


                  • #14
                    For STOL performance tip plates probably work 60 to 90% as well as something more complex, at the cost of drag. Hoerner tips are not that different than tip plates, with a big fairing between the wing and the plate.

                    Comment


                    • Battson
                      Battson commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Having done a lot of research, this is true for LSA / microlights ^
                      For heavier aircraft with double (or more) induced drag at the tips, the differences show.
                      Bolting either kind of wingtip onto a standard Bearhawk wing, a tip plate and 16" aerodynamic hoerner wingtip will be chalk and cheese. The increased span alone makes a huge difference, before considering the shape factor.

                    • svyolo
                      svyolo commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Yeah the extra span definitely helps.

                      I do think that a better tip helps an airplane like a BH more than a high aspect and/or tapered wing. A larger percentage of wing area is affected than a tapered/elliptical/higher aspect wing.

                      Better tips I would buy if I could now because I haven't installed the kit tips yet., but they are farther down the improvement list if I have to make my own. Lighter doors are probably #1 after I get 'er flying.
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