LSA/Patrol Instrument Panel Size

[Craig Van Sickle]

For guys with flying LSA/Patrols:

Do you have any thoughts on the panel size/angle. The plan drawings are quite small. I did my best to scale and cut a planning template. It looks to be 10" tall in the center. The Patrol plans show a small detail which looks like it should be tipped away from the pilot around 5 degrees.

Any thoughts? Things you would change or like about yours?

Much appreciated,

Craig

IMG_7811.jpgIMG_7815.jpgIMG_7814.jpgIMG_7820.jpg

[davzLSA]

Hi Graig, I have recently spoken to Bob on this very subject. He said that since the panel is not structural it really did not matter what size you made it and as far as tilt goes that would depend on your instrumentation. The factors that would determine the panel size will be sight over the nose on the ground and what degree of tilt your instruments can handle As for me I have increased the vertical height of my panel by 1 inch. I am using a g5 as a PFD with steam gauges as back ups. If you are really concerned I suggest you give Bob a call, He is very approachable and easy to talk to.

David

[Craig Van Sickle]

Thanks Dave, appreciate it. I'm not concerned, was just looking for input from those that have flown and if they had any thoughts. Sometimes that after the fact perspective is very handy. All the best.

[BTAZ]

I think mine was scaled from the plans. No problem fitting what I wanted.

After this was taken, I added two toggle switches for the mags and one momentary toggle for the starter on the right.

On the left I added the ELT remote and a cigarette lighter outlet for 12V.

My handheld is velcro'd on the left side of the panel over those two items.


One change is the compass has never worked quite right where I located it to center top of panel. Probably needs to be mounted out of the panel at the top of the windscreen

[Craig Van Sickle]

Thanks Batz, really appreciate those photos and thoughts. Are you flying with a handheld radio?

[BTAZ]

Purposely built without an "Engine driven electrical system" to avoid ADSB and a transponder requirement for the Class B 30 NM ring I operate out of.

I operate out a very busy class D(KFFZ, typically in the top 3 in the US because of flight training) without any issue and have been "No Transponder" for all but 1 plane in the past 30 years I've been based here.

I have an EarthX battery and an electric starter and I use the onboard battery to run my handheld, tablet, and intercom.

If it dies in flight, the radio and tablet have their own internal batteries that would go another few hours.

Handheld feeds an antenna mounted on the belly and ties into my 2p intercom and headsets.

I have gone as long as 15 hours between charges but typically plug in every 5 hours or so.

Battery is connected up via a "high current" connector(similar to what is on a golf cart) so I can remove it from the plane to charge if not in my hangar.

Took it to Oshkosh and back, fully charged when I left and charged the battery again after about 12 flight hours to get there, same on the return.

[Craig Van Sickle]

Love it. Creative solutions to keep things light and to the point. Appreciate all of the info and response. Just cut out a scaled seat and test fit all 6'4"+ of my cockpit consuming body. Just enough room. This is honestly a big motivation for building. So many midget sized cockpits out there.

IMG_7882.jpgIMG_7842.jpg

[BTAZ]

I'm 6'2" and about 220 lbs, more legs than torso. I built my seat to plans and comfortably fly one notch forward from the rearmost setting.

Plenty of room and a big reason why I went with this plane.

The best part is I can fit in the back as well!

And even with the seat set where I am comfortable the back seater still has plenty of room.

I fit great in the front of the Christavia I had while building the LSA but the back seat in it was a bit of a "joke".

[Bcone1381]

A couple small details I'll add. My Kit instrument panel (circa 2017) is a touch too small to fit a G3 10" screen, so that eliminated a popular option when I choose my avionics. I'd make it to fit the latest large experimental screen even if your not going to use it.

Second...the ideal solution Instrument Panel and Firewall position results in a the top fo the boot cowl and the top of the engine cowl having a straight profile from the instrument panel to the nose bowl. As I write this post, waiting until you hang your engine and nose bowl to start on the firewall and panel seems like a significant complexity . SO maybe I should point out that perfection is a enemy to completion. But if you go too far off the normal panel size it may have a slight visual impact that you'll see it at the end of the build.

Screen Shot 2022-02-13 at 10.01.18 AM.png

[BTAZ]

What Bcone described is basically what I did.

Installed the engine and nose bowl, then pulled strings from the nose bowl to the top of the instrument panel to establish the outline of the top half of the firewall.

Made the first firewall out of aluminum, got all the firewall mounted accessories positioned and the various pass through's, then transferred it to titanium.

[spinningwrench]

I have a .dxf file of the Patrol panel if anyone wants to get in touch I’ll send the file. Send a message with your e-mail

[Craig Van Sickle]

Appreciate this, thanks for sending that over!

[Light&Sweet]

Purposely built without an "Engine driven electrical system" to avoid ADSB and a transponder requirement for the Class B 30 NM ring I operate out of.

I operate out a very busy class D(KFFZ, typically in the top 3 in the US because of flight training) without any issue and have been "No Transponder" for all but 1 plane in the past 30 years I've been based here.

I have an EarthX battery and an electric starter and I use the onboard battery to run my handheld, tablet, and intercom.

If it dies in flight, the radio and tablet have their own internal batteries that would go another few hours.

Handheld feeds an antenna mounted on the belly and ties into my 2p intercom and headsets.

I have gone as long as 15 hours between charges but typically plug in every 5 hours or so.

Battery is connected up via a "high current" connector(similar to what is on a golf cart) so I can remove it from the plane to charge if not in my hangar.

Took it to Oshkosh and back, fully charged when I left and charged the battery again after about 12 flight hours to get there, same on the return.

We think alike, sir. I fly away from congested airspace. I have been flying my Champ from under the ORD Class B and surveillance ring with a handheld vhf for 7-years. Occasionally, when I transition a local class D the tower is confused and informs me I need to call Chicago Center for no surveillance flight. Many pilots I speak to about my Champ do not understand how I can fly with no electric inside the veil or under the class B.

With today’s cheap and relatively efficient solar panels, I thought incorporating a flexible PV panel into a Patrol build would be a way to supplement the battery only system....thought of this way before Mr Patey started Scrappy

[Craig Van Sickle]

This is all great info, thanks guys.

[Craig Van Sickle]

Here's what I came up with for my panel size/angle. There's a 10" dynon for reference.

Screen Shot 2022-02-15 at 8.00.03 PM.pngScreen Shot 2022-02-15 at 8.00.31 PM.pngIMG_7923.jpgIMG_7926.jpg image_11253.png

[Bcone1381]

Consider also if the Garmin 10" screen fits. It has a rather large bezel. I don't know if 10" is the screen size or the outside bezel dimension.

[Craig Van Sickle]

I’ll check that this evening.

[Craig Van Sickle]

Just enough room. .375" clearance bottom and top corners.

Screen Shot 2022-02-16 at 6.38.03 PM.png