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  • Bearhawk LSA Numbers

    Just completed an enjoyable trip in N514AK, Marks Bearhawk LSA, Austin to Sebring and back to Austin. I wanted to pass on some information to the Bearhawk group from my flight back yesterday. Last summer flying the LSA from Texas up to Oshkosh there were some oil temp issues that prevented me from observing normal operation long term. The oil temp issue has since been taken care so I had full range of power settings to play with this trip. Yesterday I flew the LSA from central Florida to Austin, Texas. The total trip duration was 9 hours 56 minutes including two 30 minute fuel breaks so just under 9 hours actual flight time. Total distance was 960 SM. I had a headwind of 10-15 mph for most of the trip. Average speed for the entire trip duration was 97mph. Minus the two 30 minute fuel stops the average ground speed computes to 107 mph. Remove the headwind component and you get a good idea of actual cruse speed. I ran 75% power for the entire trip. I couldn't get an accurate fuel burn my first leg because my tanks were not completely topped off since I had to fuel up at an airport other than the departure airport but it still came in at 5.8 gph. The second leg was more accurate point to point for a fuel burn of 5.6 gph. Climb performance with full fuel, 170 lbs in the front and 50-60 lbs in the back was 1,000 - 1,200 fpm. That was a climb to 2'000. I didn't fly any higher than that because the headwind picked up significantly with altitude. Marks LSA now has a Catto prop on it and it performs very well. In my opinion the way Mark has his LSA set up now is absolutely perfect! I wouldn't change a thing. The thing I really like about this airplane is its simplicity. There's no need to reach down and grab a flap handle or cross check you speed before pulling the next notch of flaps and no prop control to mess with. Mixture, throttle and carb heat - it doesn't get any simpler than that! Not to mention its a blast to fly. After I landed yesterday I told Mark that the LSA is my favorite model of Bearhawk... Then he reminded me that I have said that about every other model of Bearhawk that I have flown!... 😍😄 Oh and one more thing - this airplane doesn't need any stink'n flaps! Take a look at the attached photo of runway 33. Notice there are only two exit taxiways off the runway - one just beyond the threshold (where the fuel tank is) and the other clear at the end. Guess which taxiway I used landing on runway 33? I didn't need to turn around and back taxi nor did the LSA even need that much runway! There was a guy standing there watching and came over and said, "That thing sure lands short!"
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    Last edited by Wayne Massey; 01-20-2015, 04:29 PM.
    Wayne Massey - Central Florida
    BH733
    LSA23
    http://www.mykitlog.com/wlmassey

  • #2
    Wayne, thanks for the report . What was the oil temp fix, other than break-in the Engine? Stinger , LSA scratch builder.

    Comment


    • #3
      The fix was to add an oil cooler. That did a great job of correcting the issue. Breaking in the engine would not have taken care of the heating issue in southern climates in the summer heats. With OAT in the low 70's the oil temp is now running around 180.
      Wayne Massey - Central Florida
      BH733
      LSA23
      http://www.mykitlog.com/wlmassey

      Comment


      • #4
        How does it handle (meaning how do the controls feel in flight) compared with a C-172. What engine does Mark have in it? I guess it must have a Marvel-Shebler carb in it since it has a mixture control.
        Brooks Cone
        Southeast Michigan
        Patrol #303, Kit build

        Comment


        • #5
          I got a chance to fly Bob's LSA and did a little write up. Here it is:

          The control forces are much lighter than a C-172. It feels just right when you fly it. Controls are light but not overly so. It just seems to do exactly what you want without a lot of effort.


          Eric Newton
          Bearhawk Tailwheels LLC
          Rugged Tailwheels for your experimental aircraft. Bearhawk Tailwheels LLC manufactures the original Bearhawk Tailwheel for bush flying.

          Bearhawk Builder Manuals
          Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
          Bearhawk Tailwheels and Builder's Manuals
          http://bhtailwheels.com

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Bcone1381 View Post
            How does it handle (meaning how do the controls feel in flight) compared with a C-172. What engine does Mark have in it? I guess it must have a Marvel-Shebler carb in it since it has a mixture control.
            Like Eric said the control forces are much lighter than a C-172. You use very little control input. When you want to turn you basically think "turn" and you are turning. To turn its a slight lead with rudder at the same time slight input of stick. The stick doesn't even move an inch. Once you break the habit of over controlling its a very comfortable feel. It's almost like the airplane is wired to your brain because it does what you think.

            Marks LSA has a Continental 0-200 built by Bob Barrows.
            Wayne Massey - Central Florida
            BH733
            LSA23
            http://www.mykitlog.com/wlmassey

            Comment


            • #7
              Wayne, are you building the LSA? What are you referring to when you state Central Florida (soon)? Stinger

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by stinger View Post
                Wayne, are you building the LSA? What are you referring to when you state Central Florida (soon)? Stinger
                Stinger - Yes I will be building an LSA from kit. We are moving from Western New York to Central Florida so I won't be able to start until we complete the move and get settled. We started the move process a little over a year ago so I had to put my Bearhawk 4-place scratch build on hold while I get our house ready to sell.

                I'll build the LSA first then finish my 4-place Bearhawk after that. The LSA will be our "play around" airplane and the 4-place will be our "cruiser". Perfect combination!
                Last edited by Wayne Massey; 01-23-2015, 08:16 AM.
                Wayne Massey - Central Florida
                BH733
                LSA23
                http://www.mykitlog.com/wlmassey

                Comment


                • #9
                  Great information if i dream i will have a stable full of barrows planes, what is the expected scratch build time for the lsa?

                  Nick
                  BH1172

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Let's revive this thread, shall we?

                    Anybody with an LSA who does NOT know or is affiliated with the Bob Barrows team have any performance specs? 0200 powered. Let's hear some realworld numbers guys

                    Comment


                    • Mark Goldberg
                      Mark Goldberg commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Since you specifically say you are not interested in what me or Bob have to say - I will not provide any numbers of what my LSA with an O200 does. However, you will find that we understate our performance numbers, and that builders almost always have performance numbers that exceed our published specs. Mark

                  • #11
                    Thanks Mark!

                    Ok builders, got any numbers?

                    Comment


                    • Mark Goldberg
                      Mark Goldberg commented
                      Editing a comment
                      I was trying to think of the kit built LSA's on the forum. I do not think many, if any, of them participate. If you are thinking of building from our kit, I can help you get information. Mark

                  • #12
                    I find it interesting that you quickly step in to speak for the builders before they do when I made it quite clear that I want to hear from the builders and not the ones who profit OR their friends. But, since you insist on chiming in to subtly skirting this subject, I'll ask you one question... How many LSA kits were sold?

                    BTW I'm saving screen shots from this thread incase it or myself magically disappears. No need to post them on all the other forums I'm a member of, lets just keep it right here at bearhawk shall we

                    Comment


                    • Mark Goldberg
                      Mark Goldberg commented
                      Editing a comment
                      You seem to have an adversarial type attitude. When I offer to help you find the info you request since the kit builders flying their LSA's are not active on the forum, you take it quite differently than I intend. So I will retire from this conversation. Mark

                  • #13
                    Cubtobearhawk, you will be pleased to know that I am not affiliated with businesses run by Mark or Bob, other than being a happy customer of both. But as a member of this forum since the Yahoo days, I kindly ask that you refrain from using threatening language, especially toward someone who is very well respected and has done nothing but attempt to help you.

                    I don't intend to start a public argument. Please contact me privately if you have a bone to pick.

                    Nic

                    Comment


                    • #14
                      Originally posted by Cubtobearhawk View Post
                      I find it interesting that you quickly step in to speak for the builders before they do when I made it quite clear that I want to hear from the builders and not the ones who profit OR their friends. But, since you insist on chiming in to subtly skirting this subject, I'll ask you one question... How many LSA kits were sold?

                      BTW I'm saving screen shots from this thread incase it or myself magically disappears. No need to post them on all the other forums I'm a member of, lets just keep it right here at bearhawk shall we
                      Welcome to the forum! We do not delete messages for disagreement or other matters of opinion, including discussions about the veracity of any company's marketing. However, we absolutely do delete messages for rudeness and uncivil language. This site is free to use, but it is not free to produce. Significant resources are devoted to provide this venue and maintain its culture, because we want to have a place to help each other out, not so that we can host the type of reply that you have posted here. We want you to be a part of the community, but we haven't heard anything about who you are, what your experience is, or what you will bring to the community. Realizing that perhaps you didn't mean for your reply to sound quite so confrontational, or that you were just having a bad day, for now you are still welcome to post, but please be advised that we won't be able to keep you around if this is the norm.

                      As I hope the archive shows, to be welcome here, one does not have to be a kool-aid drinking pro-Bearhawk cult member. But one does have to be nice.

                      Feel free to reply here, post an intro in the new members section, send a PM, etc, to let us know whether you'd like to be a contributing member of the community!

                      .

                      Comment


                      • #15
                        Mark, no disrespect. I'm sure you are quite helpful but as I stated earlier, I'm not not looking for help from someone who profits from, in my opinion, possible exaggerated or misleading performance specifications. Again, opinion. Thank you for retiring from this thread and I hope you have a great night.

                        If I'm blunt, its because I'm trying to get to the point. Since my only question to Mark was not answered, I'm going to assume that there were at least a dozen LSA kits sold. I'm sure some of you builders are on this forum. I'm also going to assume that Nichzimmerman has purchased and built a Bearhawk. I appreciate your thoughts and comments but I'd like to ask you to post your real world performance specs on whichever model you own.

                        Ok, heres the deal. Let me try to simplify this without getting sidetracked or feelings getting hurt... Lets say your neighbor, family member or just the honest, hardworking guy down the street has decided to purchase a bearhawk LSA kit based only on Bob and Marks specs and testimonials along with their friends who have flown their planes. Since thats the only source of info I could find. So, this guy/gal spends tens of thousands of their hard earned dollars, quite possibly some of their retirement fund, and dedicate possibly THOUSANDS of hours of their life to building their dream plane just to find out that its not quite performing as advertised. Doe this sound familiar to any of you? Regardless of the model. Did your plane not cruise at 140mph @ 75% power? (or whatever it was, im not going to look again but you get the point) And that may very well be the case but provide it! Or... maybe you're just in denial or choose to ignore it after all those hours and commitment? Are you "drinking the kool-aid"? If so, I ask you to post your REAL WORLD specs here. Nothing too scientific, just simple stall and cruise numbers with engine and prop. Whatever you want to provide. I'm not just asking for me, I'm asking for every future Bearhawk customer who wants to know but is afraid to ask. (you're welcome btw) You builders KNOW your planes performance. Don't be afraid to do whats right and post them here! Heck, you might even sleep better at night.

                        That being said, I think the bearhawk is a fantastic plane from what I've heard. I wouldn't be here otherwise. I'm just getting a little frustrated from the lack of performance info being shared by builders. Who's first?

                        If all you want to do is comment on my "attitude" please spare everybody and skip this thread.

                        Comment


                        • nichzimmerman
                          nichzimmerman commented
                          Editing a comment
                          Alas, I am a 9-year scratch builder (bought many sub-assemblies from Mark) who hopes to get airborne in 2020. I will definitely do a write-up when that happens.

                          If Mark is not aware of any owners of flying LSAs on this forum, I would take his word for it and allow him to put you in touch with them, as he offered.
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