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Priming with a roller???

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  • Priming with a roller???

    ok...I getting ready to take fire from all sides in the primer war....

    this is is for the tube frame not the wings...

    since the the tube frame is such a small surface area...I was thinking why not just do a light coat of primer by rolling it on with a foam roller...

    michael in toronto
    Last edited by way_up_north; 12-03-2018, 11:02 PM.

  • #2
    I guess it depends what you want the final product to look like. A sprayed finish will look better than a roller may be stating the obvious. There are exposed tubes on both sides of the windshield, and the vee to the cowl. If you plan to put a shiny topcoat on then it will highlight any texture or lines in the primer. Smooth surfaces may clean easier to boot. We used an epoxy primer that does not need a top coat that is a nice satin grey. It is a big investment in money and it may affect the value down the road if it looks too homebuilt. No fire just a friendly conversation. If you weren't looking for thoughts you would have gone ahead with the roller. At the end of the day it is your airplane and you have to look at it so no one should get too anxious about the choices.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Glenn Patterson View Post
      I guess it depends what you want the final product to look like. A sprayed finish will look better than a roller may be stating the obvious. There are exposed tubes on both sides of the windshield, and the vee to the cowl. If you plan to put a shiny topcoat on then it will highlight any texture or lines in the primer. Smooth surfaces may clean easier to boot. We used an epoxy primer that does not need a top coat that is a nice satin grey. It is a big investment in money and it may affect the value down the road if it looks too homebuilt. No fire just a friendly conversation. If you weren't looking for thoughts you would have gone ahead with the roller. At the end of the day it is your airplane and you have to look at it so no one should get too anxious about the choices.
      You make all really good points. Re-sale is always a factor. Thank you for the input. I'm trying to think of ways I can avoid building a spray booth so I don't have an over spray problem with close neighbors.

      Comment


      • #4
        Eventually you may need to build a spray booth to do a reasonable paint job. We built a temporary one with some wood framing covered in 6 mil poly. We put about 4 or 5 furnace filters on the front wall over the doors to supply clean bug free air. We built a plywood fan box that projected into the booth in the corner. The fan box was built to take a filter on one side, top and end with an old furnace fan wired so we could plug it in. The furnace fan gave good air changes and the filters on the fan box took care of the mist so we did not put out color all over the place. The air came in through the filters over the door. The booth was big enough to take the fuselage. We painted wings etc. in batches.
        Here is a thread on a hot rod site that shows a booth very much like the one we built. They work good and are not a lot of investment. The air MUST be exhausted from the space or the environment will become super toxic despite the mask and protective measures that one takes. I live in NW Ontario and it gets cold. We had a woodstove for heat and would heat the shop to about 90 and crack a door. Sprayed a coat then closed the door to let the shop heat recover. Then applied subsequent coats the same way. Environmental friendly 2 part water borne paints are every bit as deadly as the solvent based paints. The isocyanurate hardners are in both acrylic and urethane paints no matter the diluent.
        When I was a kid we would spray in the back yard early in the morning when the air was usually calm.
        This is the link. https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...460009/page-35
        I started about where the booth construction is by Blue One. Blue One also painted his roadster with a quality turbine sprayer. his paint looks decent but I know nothing about the system. His info starts at page 35 so the link will shorten the search. Some where in there towards the end he writes about the turbine system he used. I personally like air as it is what I am comfortable with and reasonable cost for equipment.
        Last edited by Glenn Patterson; 12-04-2018, 10:24 AM.

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        • Glenn Patterson
          Glenn Patterson commented
          Editing a comment
          Epoxy hardener is a different than urethane so it is a lower threat. If I had to do the paint over I would switch it. I would use the Stewarts fabric glue & UV Coat the go with Endura urethanes. Endura is a Canadian product and the have a grade for fabric. You can consult their tech people as they may have a complete system. The product wears like iron and has a good history. The Endura is a solvent grade but in terms of health risk to use is the same as the water base urethanes. It sprays out like regular auto paint and is not as fussy as waterborne products. The Endura is half the cost of Stewarts or other aircraft paints plus a huge savings on shipping. It is available locally from our auto parts store & should be an easy find in bigger centers.
          Last edited by Glenn Patterson; 12-04-2018, 01:50 PM.

      • #5
        Good info! I see where the Endura line is available in the states through; http://www.polyglasscoatings.com/
        Thanks!

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        • #6
          I painted my fuselage (the tubing) with a brush. I tried to spray it but the epoxy paint I was using (Macro-poxy) was so thick I wasn't happy with how it came out of the gun. My fuselage came with epoxy primer and paint from the factory but there were a few places that the paint had either been scratched or just didn't have good coverage in some of the joints. I sandblasted the spots that had a bit of light rust and ended up painting the whole thing. Then I sprayed the tubes that show in the cockpit with the same paint I used for the trim on the outside of the plane. I'm happy with it.

          And I know one guy who used a roller to paint the interior fabric of his Cub and you would never know it. I know another guy who used a roller to paint his whole plane. With Latex house paint. With no prep. Over fabric that had the original paint flaking off. That one didn't look so good, but I think if it was done on new fabric it would look ok. Not going to win any awards for finish but neither will mine. Bush plane.
          Rollie VanDorn
          Zanesville, OH
          Patrol Quick Build

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          • #7
            I’ll never paint an airframe again. Powder coating is better in almost every way. Powder coating isn’t going to hide anything that epoxy paint won’t. I could have had my airframe powder coated for less than what I paid for the paint and to have it sand blasted.
            I'm a Tapatalk user so I can't see your "comment"

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            • #8
              Originally posted by whee View Post
              I’ll never paint an airframe again. Powder coating is better in almost every way. Powder coating isn’t going to hide anything that epoxy paint won’t. I could have had my airframe powder coated for less than what I paid for the paint and to have it sand blasted.
              It's my understanding that corrosion can propagate unnoticed under powder coatings, whereas a typical primer/paint won't have this issue. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable can elaborate.
              Dave B.
              Edmonds, WA
              4 Place Quick Build

              Comment


              • #9
                We went to the Safari helicopter manufacturing plant when it was in Ear Falls ON. They TIG welded their air frames & so did we. Safari degreased the air frame and used scuff pads on the tubing and parts with no sandblasting. Safari then shot their air frames with Imron. They had being that for years and had no issues with their paint. We followed Safari's lead to paint our fuselage and have had no issues with the paint to date. We had 3 people scuffing then did a final wipe down with degreaser and shot the epoxy. A person could scuff an airframe and paint it in sections as long as all the exposed tubing is shot on the same day so it is a consistent colour the rest does not matter if there are variances if it is out of sight. Nice thing is that if a person wants to do a mod or weld to the air frame with epoxy then it is easy to match & do touch ups.

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                • #10
                  Archer, your understanding is one of the commonly used arguments. Epoxy paint/primer isn’t typical though and rust can propagate under it unnoticed too.
                  I'm a Tapatalk user so I can't see your "comment"

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                  • #11
                    Originally posted by whee View Post
                    I’ll never paint an airframe again. Powder coating is better in almost every way. Powder coating isn’t going to hide anything that epoxy paint won’t. I could have had my airframe powder coated for less than what I paid for the paint and to have it sand blasted.
                    I originally intended on powder coating the frame. I had most of my control pieces, sticks, rudder pedals etc powder coated. The local outfit was expensive and I wasn't very happy with the quality. Now they say their insurance company won't allow them to do aircraft parts. There were powder coaters in both Anchorage and Wasilla, that do a lot of aircraft frames. Alaska Airframes uses the one in Wasilla. If I was still in Alaska would have been glad to go with one of them. Many people don't realize that powder coat is just a generic term. There are about as many types of powder coat as there are paints. You wan't to make sure that your powder coater is using a high quality powder suitable for steel, and definitely a primer coat and top coat.

                    I would be surprised if Airframes Alaska doesn't do there own powder coating at this point.
                    Last edited by rodsmith; 12-05-2018, 03:20 PM.

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                    • #12
                      WAYUPNORTH,
                      I responded yesterday but it didn't make it online.

                      Businesses have a different set of priorities than individuals. I wouldn't worry about following the practices of a business on your build. "Convention" on almost everything is to make the exposed parts beautiful, and unexposed, "protected". Mercedes doesn't put a beautiful paint job on the bottom of their cars.

                      I bought a kit that came epoxy primed. If I did a scratch build, I would paint the tubing with a brush and roller, and would only make the exposed tubing "beautiful".

                      Spraying is a great technique. But on a tube fuselage it wastes some paint. I would sandblast sections at a time and brush or roll.

                      High end tables have the table top looking like a sheet of glass. The bottom, not so much.

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                      • #13
                        With that in mind, does the underlying finish on the tubing tend to project through the fabric at all? Or do the layers of tape and finish hide it?
                        ​Christopher Owens, EAA #808438
                        Project "Expedition"
                        Bearhawk 4-Place Scratch Built, Plans #991
                        Bearhawk Patrol Scratch Built, Plans #P313
                        Germantown, Wisconsin, USA

                        Comment


                        • #14
                          Originally posted by way_up_north View Post
                          ok...I getting ready to take fire from all sides in the primer war....

                          this is is for the tube frame not the wings...

                          since the the tube frame is such a small surface area...I was thinking why not just do a light coat of primer by rolling it on with a foam roller...

                          michael in toronto
                          Going back to your original post, I think using a roller is fine. Just make sure you apply a top coat over the primer, all primers are porous and steel will rust.

                          Comment


                          • #15
                            Originally posted by rodsmith View Post

                            Going back to your original post, I think using a roller is fine. Just make sure you apply a top coat over the primer, all primers are porous and steel will rust.
                            Another thought, although I have no experience with either but would like to try it. There's a series on latex paint at http://wienerdogaero.com/Latex.php that I really enjoyed watching. Latex paint doesn't apply here, but the application method he used with a close-cell foam roller and a sheet of glass as your paint pan might be useful to minimize bubbles and patterns in your paint as you roll it on. (As I try not to stray too far from the original post).
                            ​Christopher Owens, EAA #808438
                            Project "Expedition"
                            Bearhawk 4-Place Scratch Built, Plans #991
                            Bearhawk Patrol Scratch Built, Plans #P313
                            Germantown, Wisconsin, USA

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