Build Log / Inspection Requirements

[DesertBearhawk]

At the risk of having the entire Bearhawk Forum membership rain the smack-down on me I ask this question:

What is REQUIRED in terms of a build log and or inspections? I am an A&P, not sure that makes a bit of difference. I have been taking TONS of pictures and I pseudo blog on my Desert Bearhawk Facebook page, and then there is my YouTube channel....all of which is a digital record of what I am doing and how I do it. I do have Kit Log Pro but I really dont like it and dont really use it. Do I have to have a written narrative with time spent on each step and what not?

I dont want to get to the end of this project only to have my friendly FAA inspector come down on me for whatever....I already have little use for the FAA that I would rather keep my exposure to them to a minimum....

So what say you guys?

[bestbearhawk1231]

I hear ya with the feds...I have been keeping the written log with the date, times, time spent, and what I did. I also try to take a bunch of photos but once I get into a groove, I end up slacking a bit on the photos. It is hard for me to get pics of myself while I am working since I am not married and work funky hours when most people are sleeping. All reciepts go into a separate binder along with user manuals I pick up as I go. I had been using kit log pro but found it to be a PITA. When my laptop took a dump and I was unable to transfer everything to my new computer, I gave up and scrapped the program. I tried to get it to work with their help but it was not reliable after the transfer. All pictures are on a thumb drive and my computer hard drive. I would have your local EAA tech counselor stop by and get the paperwork rolling with that. He will take a look at your work, answer questions, make a log book entry and fill out a form. Make sure you get a copy of the form, he or she will keep a copy and the 3rd copy will get mailed to corporate EAA. Hopefully you have a better experience with your Tech Counselor than I am having, won't go too far in depth about it on this form but corporate EAA is involved. My biggest fear is that I end up with some "that" fed to sign off on the plane and it will be some stupid little detail that becomes the show stopper. You know as well as I do that what is no big deal to one Fed is a showstopper to another. At least when you work around them for a living, you know what to expect from the regulars. I would definitely get the EAA Tech Counselor involved if you have not already. As I understand it, EAA went a few rounds with the FAA to use them as a way to keep the feds out during the building process. It is definitely easier to ask a member of your local chapter for help and not worry about wording a question wrong than it is to ask a Federal Inspector and have them get all up in arms because the question wasn't worded how they wanted or expected it to be worded.

So, bottom line is that is how I am doing it but it may not be right. I am going off of how things would have been done in the 90s before computers, cell phones, video cameras were plentiful and affordable. I don't make videos since I don't have a video camera and I feel my time is better spent moving forward on my project. That is also one reason you won't see autocad pictures on my postings, it is easier to sketch it out on a yellow scratch pad then toss it into a folder for safekeeping.

[X'N]

I was looking at buying kit log pro but from the sounds of it I shouldn't waste my $.

Right now I normally use Google drive and made up a form I have a short cut to on my phone. I'm able to quickly make a log entry and it puts it in Excel format. Bad thing is I can't submit photo's with it.

[Enewton57]

Like many things, it will depend on your FAA inspector. Some expect more, others don't expect much. I have found that some spend more time looking at the airplane and some spend more time on paperwork. I know builders who just showed a few polaroid pictures of themselves building and others have elaborate logs and photo albums. I would print out your blog with a few of the pictures, or if you can arrange it, show the inspector the blog. After you make application, your inspector will be in touch with you a few times before the inspection. Give him a link to your blog and ask if that is sufficient for the builder log. One other thing they like to see is EAA tech counselor visits. However, since you are an A&P that might not be as important to the inspector. If you were atotslly inexperienced builder, the EAA tech counselor visits are more important. Most inspectors like to see some sort of log describing what you have done. If you scratch build, they want to see some of the processes you used to make the parts. This is not necessarly so much for the airworthiness certificate but is more for the repairman's certificate. Some inspectors ask you a lot of detailed questions to ascertain whether or not you are the actual builder and not hat it was built by a hired gun.

[Barry]

Dave, I created a notebook with tabs. I have a tab for my notes, a tab for my building log which includes the date, task accomplished and the time spent. I take pictures every time I work on the plane. I keep the pictures on Dropbox website (which is free) and on my computer. I am working with my local EAA chapter and we have a tech counselor as well. This is how I am going to do it. I prefer the "keep it simple stupid" method of things. Do keep the Youtube videos coming for the rest of us, not the FAA!

[jaredyates]

The only requirement is that you convince your inspector that you did the work. It seems to me that 5 minutes of conversation would answer that question, but then again I don't work for the FAA. The tech counselor visits are not required by the FAA, but my insurance company required them. The tech counselor always found things that I needed to address, so it was worthwhile anyway.

[Battson]

I had no documented visits from IA's (they still happened, just zero paperwork). During the build I took like 2,000 photos, and wrote a log record of each day's work. That was more than enough for my inspector.

[tailwind]

I guess that it all depends on the tech counselor. I had all of 12 pictures on my last build, none of them showed me in the picture. I did have a spread sheet of the parts that I purchased along with the supporting receipts for the build with the total expenditures. There was a date column that indicated when I began the project and when I finished purchasing parts and the build. We had no problem with documentation at all. As far as I know there is no requirement for periodic inspections but I did have signed evidence of periodic inspections. I wanted them to satisfy my self that I was not missing things as I went along. YMMD

[oismith]

As Jared says, all you are required to do is to convince the inspector you performed at least 51% of the tasks. Some things the FAA suggests should be considered are pictures or a written builder's log, recorded inspections by EAA tech counselors or others, annotated plans, jigs and fixtures, records of purchased parts, and in the case of a plans-built project, the FAA task checklist. As Jared also said, a good inspector should be able to tell whether you actually did the work in a 5 minute conversation. In my experience most of the FAA guys are paper pushers who barely look at the project except for required placards/markings and documents. In some geographical areas amateur-built inspections are being done by MIDOS instead of FSDOS. In my experience the MIDO personnel are used to inspecting manufactrurer's records, not completed aircraft or even actual parts thereof. Many are not A&Ps. The FSDO inspectors that do not work in enforcement mostly work with repair facilities and are therefore A&Ps. Deal with the FSDO if you can, else you might be better off paying a DAR. That being said, keep in mind that all inspectors need to assemble a permanent file for the aircraft which goes to OKC. It's much easier to include copies of pictures or a builder's log than write a write an account of his conversations with you documenting questions and responses that convinced him you did the work. The less qualified the inspector is, the more important your documentation will probably be.

[bestbearhawk1231]

You mention a FAA task checklist...what is that exactly? Is it something that needs to be done as you go or is it one of those things you fill out at the end?

[Flynguy521]

Just a thought for other programs besides kit log. Evernote is an awesome note taking program that is available on PC/Mac/android, and it cross syncs any new data over all platforms. Blogger/blogspot by Google is another program/website. The benefit to it is you can share your build with the world. It also has an app for Mac/android. Best of both of them is they are free and highly customizable. For what it's worth...,

[alaskabearhawk]

Here's what the EAA has to offer: http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuil...ers%20Log.html

I use the Kitlog Pro and really like it. I customized it for my build, it keeps track of my parts and expenses, backs up my data and is easy to use. I would recommend it. Another reason for using the Kitlog Pro is it has your stuff online. My friends follow my build and kick me in the pants to build if I haven't posted in awhile.The other part is others can look at your log. I can't count how many times I have looked at Ron Jones and Wayne Massey's Kitlogs. It helps...a LOT. So, your log can help others in addition to fulfilling a requirement.