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  • Tires and Wheels

    This post is to hopefully help some prior to or currently in the decision process

    Get 8” wheels

    I really wanted to get 8” wheels when I was in the sourcing and early building stages. Why? Well I do a lot of landings on unimproved (i.e. gravel, dirt and grass strips) and wanted tires larger than 8.50’s (21” diameter). Truth be told, I landed all over the backcountry strips in Utah and Idaho with 8.50’s and spring gear, so yes it can be done. In my opinion, BY FAR the best designed BC (backcountry) tires are the Alaska Bushwheels (tires)with their internal stem design which eliminates stem shearing in the event of excessive braking with tire tubes and stems in the wheels. So why larger than 8.50? While the 8.50’s were adequate, they are not ideal for some of the strips, especially the uphill strips (Cabin Creek, Soldier Bar etc…) that have the washout rubber strips that can create a bit if a step/bump. Reason #2 why NOT to run ABW is they wear out very quickly when landing on pavement, unless you need larger than 31” ABW’s you can use 6” wheels so you are good to go IF you can deal with the high wear of the soft ABW’s you are good to go with 6” wheels.

    So all that said…. Why the 8” wheels? Because I 100% believe the Desser 27” tires are the way to go. Why? Well they have in my opinion a perfect balance in size for rougher strips but still small enough to not cause too much drag to hurt cruise speeds more than I can palate. Also the Desser 27’s are durable like the Goodyear 26’s that are currently on my yet to fly plane. So with the 27’s you have an actual 27” tire as opposed to the GY 26’s that are truly only 24” diameter and look like 8.50’s on a BH compared to how they looked on the Rans.

    So by this point it is clear the 27” Desser tires are designed for an 8” wheel. BH/Mark Goldberg had/has? a discount with Grove so I felt like I was tied to Grove. Dumb on my part. At the time (Covid) Grove did not have 8” wheels and were not planning to make them anytime soon. I inquired about 10” wheels (Desser has a 29” tires too that is mounted on a 10” tire) which were also not available at the time. I was put on a waitlist for both the 8” and 10” wheels. Funny in that this week Grove called me to see if I was still interested in the 10” wheels as they were going to make a batch. Still no call on the 8”! I was smart enough to research tires, but too dumb to think outside the Grove box. I absolutely should have gone to Matco (local here in Utah) and gone with their 8” wheels. The other option is Beringer but not sure how this plays out.

    Sadly using anything besides Beringer you need to change out your brake calipers when going from 6” to 8” wheels. So being currently too far down the road and at the end of my budget I will stay with the 6” wheels, but hopefully some of you will use this post to make the best decision for your plane’s setup.
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  • #2
    FWIW, I can get parts for 6in wheels anywhere if needed.

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    • #3
      I was on wait lists for the Grove 10" wheels for about 3 years. I got a call in December letting me know that they were finally available and I grabbed them. Over the time I had been waiting the price had doubled. I wasn't impressed with what I ended up paying for the wheels and the 31" Dessers but I am happy with the product.

      Switching from Matco 6" wheels and 31" Bushwheels to 10" Groves and 31" Dessers lightened my plane by about 1 pound. I was able to sell the Bushwheels and the Matcos to cover about half of the cost and now I don't worry about avoiding paved runways.
      Rollie VanDorn
      Findlay, OH
      Patrol Quick Build

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      • #4
        I'm also of the opinion that those Desser 27" tires would be about perfect for the places I want to go. Sure wish they would make them for a 6" wheel.

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        • #5
          I still worry about tubeless tires popping a bead or tubed tires slipping and shearing a valve stem. When does AirFrames' patent on built in tubes expire? (...or what ever is preventing competition?) I also need to have 6" wheels for when on skis.

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          • #6
            I am not convinced.

            The underlying assumption is 27" Desser tires are the ultimate, which is far from certain.

            The standard size wheels and AK Bushwheels are the proven solution.

            I get the AKBs are expensive, but the grass is always greener over the fence... there is a reason they are so well liked.

            Having tried the cheaper alternatives like Goodyear tires, there really is no comparison to ABWs. If you are serious about off airport work, I would not be getting Desser tires by default.

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            • Battson
              Battson commented
              Editing a comment
              Not to mention - a huge percentage of light single GA aircraft use 6 inch wheels. Getting tires suitable for 8" wheels, which are the right design for an aircraft our size, would not be as common.

            • Utah-Jay
              Utah-Jay commented
              Editing a comment
              Battson I am not landing off airport, I am landing on strips that can sometimes be a bit rough. 50% of my landings will be on pavement, so no reason to use ABW with their soft rubber that does not last.

            • Battson
              Battson commented
              Editing a comment
              Understood - the original post reads like everyone should buy 8" wheels, which I am not convinced about.

          • #7
            I agree that the 27” Desser may not be ideal, primarily due to the 8” wheel, which offers little to no flexibility regarding different tire sizes. If that is your desired tire size, you might look at 10” wheels with 850-10s. The Desser smooth 850-10 is 25-26” and can be purchased for $375 each. The 10” wheels will give you many more options than the 8” wheels. Desser smooth 850-10s, 29s, and 31s, as well as 35” bushwheels. When Desser first came out with these tires around 7-8 years ago they were priced very well. The popularity has jacked the price on them to an obscene level. However, the 850-10s seem to be the only one that is still at “normal” pricing.

            I’m fortunate to have 2 great airplanes in my hangar and both are on Grove 10” wheels and brakes with Desser smooth tires. My Patrol has been on desser 31s for over 5 years now and I swap 35” bushwheels onto the airplane for summer/fall off airport flying. Love the Desser 31s, love the 35s for off airport, but don’t like how heavy they are. My 185 has the stc’d Grove 10” setup with Desser smooth 850-10s which I am really liking thus far. I don’t want bushwheels on the 185 for the same reason that I don’t want them year round on my Patrol, too many paved runways. I think the 850-10 might be the perfect 180/185 tire size, at least for my needs. I lost no speed going from 850-6 to the 850-10 and gained a much larger, smooth tire, which I prefer for a rough dirt strip that I frequent.

            Summary…for me, the 10” wheel with the Desser smooth tundra offerings has been the proper path. The 31s on the Patrol are wearing like iron with tons of pavement landings. I think I’ll get another 5 years out of them. If I want to go smaller, the 850-10 is less expensive than most 850-6s and has a much larger footprint and height. The Desser 29 is popular amongst the stc’d C180/185 crowd, primarily because the 31 isn’t stc’d yet. Bottom line, you might take a second look at the Grove 10” wheels and brakes.

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            • #8
              I would love to have 10" wheels for the various Desser tundra tire options. Just checked prices and totally shocked at $4500 for Grove and $5600 for Alaska bush wheel. I have an extra set of 6" wheels and disks. When I feel I am ready for something larger than 8.50x6 I will probably buy the ABW 29". Will be a quick change over from the 8.50s when I will be doing off airport landings. A neighbor put in a 1200' grass strip next to our 5000' paved runway. I can taxi a 1/4 mile to it mostly on gravel when on bushwheels.

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              • #9
                Originally posted by kestrel View Post
                I still worry about tubeless tires popping a bead or tubed tires slipping and shearing a valve stem. When does AirFrames' patent on built in tubes expire? (...or what ever is preventing competition?) I also need to have 6" wheels for when on skis.
                When my plane was ground looped the tubless Desser 850x10 tire peeled off the bead. Had that not happened things would have been much less exciting. I’m planning to put tubes in the tires.

                I’m still a little bitter about the Desser tires cracking so badly but I do really like the 850x10 size. There isn’t anywhere in Idaho I need bigger tires than like a 800x6 but this size smooths out the bumps a bit and didn’t cost me any speed. They are a good compromise.


                Scratch Built 4-place Bearhawk. Continental IO-360, 88" C203 McCauley prop.

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