What would you have done differently?

[whee]

Question for those that have built and are flying their Bearhawk. I know others will respond too and that’s ok. Everyone’s opinion is welcome...mostly😉

So, what do you wish you had done different? Big or small things. Think along the lines of a second build of the same model you already built.

[rodsmith]

Not flying but I would have been much more careful with weight. An example is my skylight structure is all steel, could have been done in aluminum. I dread the weigh in.

[Bdflies]

I’m not supporting excessive unnecessary weights, but I want to relate a recent conversation; Lunch with a friend (who’s spent a lifetime in aviation), the subject of A/C came up. I’m in Louisiana, ya know..It gets hot and humid... I explained my reluctance because it would add about 30 lbs. He asked how much gas the Patrol held. 55 gals, I replied. Lex smiled and said that the A/C would cost about 5 gallons of fuel, at gross...
I’d never really thought of it that way. If I could have A/C and ONLY carry 50 gals of gas, I think I could live with that!

Bill

[tailwind]

The Bearhawk with the 180 horse is a nice combination but I would at least give strong consideration to an 540 lyc.
I moved the engine controls below the instrument panel on a separate panel to make room for radio installs. Big waste of time. I would save the panel space with remote radios where possible.
I used a MT prop that I found a bargain on but with the light engine I could use a heavier prop.
Look at options for rudder trim. My rudder trim seems to change with different loads.
I have about 200 trouble free hours on it currently. I wanted a experimental aircraft that would be as reliable as the family car and I feel that I have met the goal. Since I built it I have also obtained the repairman certificate which greatly reduces the cost of ownership. If you built from a kit when finished you will not be disappointed with your plane.

[way_up_north]

I`m not flying so skip my post if you looking for that....its a mix of items

I`m still in layout as my build is going to differ from the norm in a few ways....



Make the ribs with the mini flange around the nose instead of the blade edge it has now against the inside of the wing skin nose, I believe eliminating a small flat spot that runs the whole length of the wing top and bottom along the nose area. The most recent factory pictures show this mini flange on the nose ribs. I`m not sure what model I was looking at(if all models use the same rib) looks like the factory has made this change already
image_5731.jpg

Make ribs with flanges on the spar edges, so you can assemble the wings with no jigs...using a table...on the floor if you want(any flat surface) simplifying construction-similar to how Zenieth does it.using rails on the flat surface supporting the front and back of the ribs during assembly.
P1070749.JPG

Build the seats like the builders POPs was doing...with the crank seat adjuster and fold down bed/cargo option. In my opinion this should be the stock seat option for the bearhawk.

ask the moderators to re-open the yahoo groups...so builders like myself who embrace the idea of the experimental aircraft designation(making modifications..etc) can have somewhere to communicate with others of like mind. and not clutter up the orthodox factory forum...

Build a wet wing fuel tank based on the RV-7 tank....already called vans and asked about some of their hard to find aluminum extrusion, proseal (wet tank making toys) they use in that plane and they are willing to sell some items to non plans holders. one stop shop for this modification.
14aug13g.JPG

put in the skylight as others have done....

at home oven - make bubble windows for more cabin room and have arm rest.---this entails making a box that fits over your open oven door. making a larger oven to heat the plastic and do a gravity droop window.
bubble-window4.jpg

(Already done)download and archive alaska bearhawk and desert bearhawk youtube videos....there is so little video online about the build of these planes that its a good idea to save these, cause youtube could delete a lot of videos en-mass that don't generate income at anytime. The de-monitization has begun and the next step would be to cut loose low income videos....kinda like how yahoo killed geo-cities...

Thats it for now...im sure there will be more

[whee]

Way up north, I’m going to attempt a reply that is pointed and I’ll probably sound like a jerk but I don’t mean it that way. I hope you don’t take offense.

Your reply is exactly the type I was hoping to avoid. You have no Bearhawk experience, either building or flying, so nowhere to speak from when answering the question posed. You have some ideas that you’d like to execute but don’t know if they will make the plane better or worse. Or if they will require such extensive deviations that they won’t be worth the effort required to complete them. I understand wanting to share ideas but on this particular thread your reply is so far off in left field it’s not helpful.

One point I will agree on; for whatever reason the Bearhawk community isn’t too keen on the spirit of EAB aircraft. I too gave up looking for that here. It’s Bobs way or the highway around these parts😁 Usually Bobs way is the best way, that is after all why we like BHs, but EAB is about building the aircraft we want and trying things we want to try. Getting help to make things work that are different from the norm is not something you will find much of on this forum.

[alaskabearhawk]

This is from Rich Davidson and may be more in line of what you are looking for. Almost 10 years ago he brought Mark's BH up to the trade show in Alaska. Hard to believe it's been that long! This is what he wrote about the Bearhawk and his observations on the flight up and back. I've taken most of his suggestions and incorporated them in my build in one form or another:

"Initial notes from Bearhawk flight to Alaska
Things I would do to or with a Bearhawk if I was building one:


While flying the Bearhawk in colder weather climates, and now having looked at other Bearhawks with a flight experience frame of mind, I have been working on a list of things that might want to be considered. Please remember that I am always of the “use the hell out of it” mentality and I absolutely hate a plane that is even remotely a pain to operate. The plane should not get in your way. Those of you who don’t care to have wires running all over your cockpit from all sorts of headsets and electronics because you always take them home because they are not built won’t bother with many of these and you aren’t a bad person if this is you. Those who only fly when the winds are 5 knots or less and always hangar the plane won’t or maybe even shouldn’t bother reading any of this. Those of who clean the airplane after every flight, worry about every little scratch, and are so particular that nobody likes to fly with you, then you should just move on to the posting “How to keep finger prints off my highly polished prop”. For the rest of you who want a Bearhawk for the things it offers, here are some of the things I would do:
* fuel cap vents have no protection from icing. If sits outside, there is nothing to keep out water and thus freezing. There is no cover and no good way to test them other than blowing into them. Just a thought. Again, fair weather always hangared flyers won’t have to deal with this but some way to cover would be nice.
* It is nice to be light but people in colder climates might consider a larger battery for starting when and where they cannot preheat the engine. With a pre-heat or temp of around 30 degrees, the problem is solved but if no preheat available... the problem is not knowing how warm is enough for pre-heating. Note: of course you also have to consider cold start damage but I was thus thinking about stuck somewhere and it turns quite cold.
* Builders should make a simple single hinged plate on the baffle that can be rotated down to varying degrees in front of the oil cooler to block off some of the air flow to help it warm up. If you don’t have an oil cooler, you might want to figure out some way to block off some of the incoming cowling air.
* two heat exchangers and two heater vents would be very useful.
* (nothing to do with cold) Without question I would gear down the trim to make it less sensitive and also make it turn the correct direction. It is not intuitive as you pull back on the wheel to go down and vice versa. All controls should instead be “push forward to go down and back to go up”. Mark removed one of the trim tabs but I PERSONALLY do not like it. At low speeds it now requires more effort to pull into flare or raise the nose. I PERSONALLY liked the larger two trim tabs but the plane is admittedly fine with the one…this is all about personal preference. I would love to try one without the servo tab and a better trim instead but again that is just me and none of you should take from this that anything is wrong with the plane. I love the plane as it is, but as everyone does, they think about what they would do to their own.
* wing root area on fuselage should be completely fabric covered as a lot of air comes in around the areas not covered…..read as cold blast air in cold climates.
* fresh air vents should be vents that can be closed off completely. The ones I have seen is many of them including Mark’s are great where it’s warm but another make should be fitted to anyone flying in areas that dip below 70 degrees as they only reduce airflow, when to closed, by about 85%.
* the case vent should have the common mod that allows it to breathe if it freezes over due to running cold
* John Sample recently discovered that to put large tires (tundras of 29”) on his the fairing at the rear of the gear leg got in the way and had to be modified or greatly reduced for the bottom six inches of the legs.
* Anyone thinking of building one of these who debates about putting extra fuel tanks in is insane. I’m sorry, those of you I know who are doing so (debating) have already been notified by me of this opinion. You are absolutely crazy in every last neuron of your brain not to put in the extra fuel…period. I don’t care if the tanks weighted 100lbs, put them in. You WILL need them, you will love them, and if you ever sell, boy or boy what a positive selling point. YOU CAN NEVER HAVE ENOUGH FUEL!!!! With the tanks you can also tanker fuel for you pathetic Super Cub owner buddies, tanked fuel drop offs for yourself, can have all the camp stove fuel you desire, you can offer fuel to your buddies that wish to set their 180’s slash 185’s on fire, you fly all damn day long and not need to cut the day short or take away from it by diverting for fuel…whatever the case, put the fuel in.
* No headliner and a skylights in the top would be on my list despite what a pain skylights are.
* My tail springs would have a little more bend in them.
* Lights, you never think you’ll need them until the first time you fly
* A harness that had two shoulder straps. One is not going to save you.
* Welded permanent tie down loops. This again is from a “really using the airplane” point of view and not the fair weather always hangared angle.
*Consideration for belly pod attach fittings, skiis, etc.
* Plan all headset jacks and electronic components carefully so they don’t get in the way of using the airplane. These things are a great distraction and at the very least a pain in the ass when you are trying to enjoy an evening flight. Here are ways to check for this problem; if there is something you always have to fiddle with or that you end up touching more than twice for any reason – on and off being the only two acceptable reasons, then this item is in the way and either change it or get rid of it. For a GPS, on includes initializing and for a radio on includes volume. The other way is to judge how easy it is for another pilot to get in your plane and use it without question. If it requires something like this “step here then here, over that, now take the headset and do this, put it there, carefully lean forward so that you can do this, now make sure they are there and you can start turning everything on…the switch is tricky so you have to do this, then this. Then once that is done, you wait for 3.5 seconds and do this”……OK everybody, do you get the idea? I would also install a push to talk intercom and not a noise activated. Headset jacks should not strangle you, rub on your neck constantly, or wrap around anything when left alone. Consider putting in a single jack and getting a helo headset or helo adapters….these work great.

OTHER NOTES:
*fuselage members in windshield area should be flat black to get rid of glare on windshield. *a slide forward sun visor would be nice *a control lock would be nice *new flap lever is much better *an outside air temp guage would be quite useful for help in freezing id and also density altitude considerations in places where hot, *chart pockets somewhere would be nice, cup holders (I’m not joking), fuel selector with left, right, and both.

That’s all for now."


Rich Davidson
Lee Bottom Flying Field
"Where Old Planes Go To Fly"
www.LeeBottom.com

[Mark Goldberg]

There are a few comments in this write up that are not relevant to current kit production. But will not go into it. MG

[whee]

Thanks for sharing Rich’s thoughts AKBH! Seems he didn’t like getting cold😃

[bearhawk2015]

delete...........

[whee]

I would put supercub style gas caps on and use Eric Newton’s tailwheel from the beginning. I started out with a Scott 3200 and for many reasons didn’t like it .

Why Supercub gas caps? Which ones; snorkel style or the standard vented cap?

The BH I flew had snorkel caps which seemed to work fine. My Luscombe had snorkel caps which worked fine also. Since I’ve never used the BH caps I’m curious to know your reasoning.

[bearhawk2015]

delete...........

[way_up_north]

Way up north, I’m going to attempt a reply that is pointed and I’ll probably sound like a jerk but I don’t mean it that way. I hope you don’t take offense.

Your reply is exactly the type I was hoping to avoid. You have no Bearhawk experience, either building or flying, so nowhere to speak from when answering the question posed. You have some ideas that you’d like to execute but don’t know if they will make the plane better or worse. Or if they will require such extensive deviations that they won’t be worth the effort required to complete them. I understand wanting to share ideas but on this particular thread your reply is so far off in left field it’s not helpful.

One point I will agree on; for whatever reason the Bearhawk community isn’t too keen on the spirit of EAB aircraft. I too gave up looking for that here. It’s Bobs way or the highway around these parts😁 Usually Bobs way is the best way, that is after all why we like BHs, but EAB is about building the aircraft we want and trying things we want to try. Getting help to make things work that are different from the norm is not something you will find much of on this forum.

You're about to enter a critical test phase with your aircraft....one day I'll be sitting at the end of the runway in my creation also....wondering about every nut and bolt....if putting the boots to me makes you feel better or you get more sleep...then kick away...I'm a big boy....

im not sure what I might write that will trigger you...so I'll be gentle...you better sit down for this one....

Bob Barrows approved my flange against the spar idea last week....this means no angle brackets on the spar(replaced by the ribs themselves)..that's as big a change one can make in aviation(messing with the spar)...I'm not going to bore you with the details of the conversation....since you seem closed to it....(this is experimental aviation..please ...anyone reading this build to plans)

Things change...new ideas emerge...or old ones get tried again....take your pick...

good luck with your plane....

[jaredyates]

I'd like to suggest that there is an important difference between designing an airplane, and building one that someone else has designed. Certainly there is a fine line between the two that is hard to define. It's like if a sawed-off shotgun is illegal at 19 inches or less, is there really any difference between the way one shoots if the barrel is 18.75 vs 19.25 inches? No, but yet as those numbers diverge there is a difference eventually.

We (members of this forum) are here to talk about building the airplane that Bob designed. Does that mean that we need to paint our planes maroon and white or step aside? Of course not. Where is the line? How do we define creative expression vs designing another type? They say it is impossible to define pornography, but you know when you see it. That concept applies to this and much of the rest of life too. If the culture here is that it's Bob's way or the highway, then we are failing. If the culture is to encourage folks to build to the center of the envelope and vet innovations with regard to safety and practicality, then we are doing what we are here for.

Why does it matter to the group here if you want to build whatever kind of plane you want, even if it is something inspired by Bob's designs but otherwise unique? To some degree it doesn't, but there are some downsides. When a plane enters the fleet that is described as a Bearhawk but is built very different from the plans, it will almost always fall short of the original in performance, reliability, or safety, and perhaps all three. When there is a discussion about building per the plans, and one person is talking about building something else, the discussion creeps and might not be helpful for the current participants or the quality of the archive (both important considerations for me).

We welcome disagreement and we welcome creativity. We speak, but we also listen. We require civility, and prefer constructive communication and teamwork. With each post, we strive to produce content that is helpful to builders who are undertaking the huge project of building a safe and effective airplane that was designed by a very experienced and knowledgeable designer. Building is hard enough without distraction from the most far and wide ideas. Which ones are too far and wide? Who knows. It takes some serious study to realize how complex and interrelated an airplane is. Small changes might be great. Or seemingly small changes might really be huge changes that cascade across the airframe.

As we create content here, let's strive to make it high-quality content that informs and inspires fellow builders, and creates a valuable archive for the builders of Christmas future.

How's that for a pep talk that includes guns, porn, and religion? We can do this.

[whee]

Good pep talk Jared! But I noticed you didn’t note any changes you’d make to your plane if you were building it again...so it’s perfect?😉😁

[jaredyates]

Only so many hours in the day for replies and the other one was more urgent...

[Battson]

Things I would have avoided (and have since fixed in some cases):

If living in a cold place:
- install wind-screen demister from cabin heat
- consider second heat muff and second heater airflow system *double the air volume
- consider rear pax heat (heavy)
- seal all window and door gaps sooner (simple stick-on door seals work fine)

Aerodynamics and control:
- flaps should be extended to wing root prior to covering (model B can disregard this comment)
- trim linkages without bearings (horns under the tailwing) wear out rather quickly and become sloppy. Flutter risk. Not sure what the solution is, aurora bearing wont work... clevis with plastic inserts? Replaceable bushings?
- a simple rudder trim would be nice to have (weight!)
- follow the wing template EXACTLY. I have heavy aileron control forces because my ailerons are slightly too low (drooped)

General things:
- baggage tube was too heavy, use lightest possible solution
- rear bulkhead drums like crazy with windows open if out of balance, I will have to replace it with kydex / coreflute / fibreglass
- install big tires from the word go
- wing root vents collcet rain water while parked, I would put them lower on the leading edge, or NACA duct under wing
- never use caulk, silicon is the way to seal window frames etc
- ensure the oil breather tube is sitting in the free air stream, otherwise the oil creeps all around your cowling and between panels

Structural considerations:
- use at least 0.032 alclad for the bonnet, otherwise it will drum like crazy
- still considering the axle strengthening mod, not sure if this is required, but it makes me wonder
- do not install anything on the baffles apart from SCAT tubes
- ensure the baffles have at least 1/2" clearance to the cowl all around, causes vibration and dents you precious cowl doors. Double-check after running for a while, you will see the bits you missed
- [unless you are intentionally deviating from the plans] comply with the plans in every detail and measurement, scale plans where necessary

Things I am happy about (lucky guesses as much as good judgement):
- AoA audible warning instead of a stall horn, probably the single best safety feature in the whole build, has definitely saved my bacon at least once or more
- VGs, probably the easiest performance increase for zero speed loss, approach speeds much reduced
- no autopilot (weight :-] )
- heavy fabric on tail and belly
- fuel injection with balanced injectors! Already paid for itself twice over in fuel savings. You can flow balance yourself easily
- 260hp, not too much power (expected TBO still 2000hrs), but not too little power (I rarely want more power, but it does happy in the backcountry)
- cowl flaps
- round flying wire underneath the tailwings (stone damage)
- extended hoerner wing tips
- skylight and windows in front doors (weight)
- parking brake, must-have something to stop the plane, and it's lighter and easier to operate than chocks
- ram air induction, buys us about 1" of free MAP compared to a Cessna style carb induction or over-engine induction
- quality seats with good foam, upholstery which is easy to clean (vomit, urine, blood, fish, salt water, you don't plan on it but it happens...)
- light weight carpets, great to stop the sand going all through your plane after landing in the desert / beach / river bed, weight difference is negligible

I could probably go on, but there's enough there to sink a ship already! Sorry!

[rodsmith]

Very useful information, thanks.

[nichzimmerman]

Great information here! Do you fly in IMC much Battson? Just wondering if that is a factor in your decision to forego an autopilot. Seems like it would be nice for single pilot IFR.

[Battson]

No IMC flight, day VFR only. We do long cross-country flights a lot, but only 2% of the time I want an auto-pilot, so the the weight saving is worthwhile.

[whee]

Good stuff Battson. Thanks!

[Flygirl1]

Maybe and that’s a big maybe I would have saved a lot of time and effort taking out the skylight and just have left it in, put my headliner in anyway and either put in the darkest skylight I could or have just painted it to match my paint scheme. It was a lot of extra work to take it out. Other than that, I’m happy!